Month: April 2021

In the New York Times article, I said Marvel movies aren’t cinema. Let me explain. The author, Martin Scorsese argued that compare to the movies that he known and loved for his life, Marvel movies seem to be closer to theme parks, and he doesn’t think Marvel movies can be considered as cinema. As Martin Scorsese stated in this article, “cinema was about revelation — aesthetic, emotional and spiritual revelation. It was about characters — the complexity of people and their contradictory and sometimes paradoxical natures, the way they can hurt one another and love one another and suddenly come face to face with themselves.” Martin Scorsese argued that all of the Marvel movies have something in common that they didn’t bring any types of revelation to their audience. In the other words, he believed that unlike the other types of movies, Marvel movies have no depth which offers the audience something to think about, therefore, their audience would not learn anything by watching Marvel movies. Martin Scorsese used “Theme Parks” as a metaphor which illustrates the idea that Marvel movies have no educational values, just like people who go to amusement parks, they were having a wonderful experience, however, they got nothing more but fun.  As a matter of fact, Marvel movies have “depths”, they do have something for their audience to think about. Throughout all of the Marvel movies, Avengers is the most successful union alliance that unites various heroes from all over the universe. Although there have been failures and differences, in the end, they united unprecedentedly and kept the peace of the entire universe. Iron Man used the knowledge taught by his father to create new elements and invented a stable time the travel machine before the final battle, Hulk and Banner finally merged into one, becoming Dr. Hulk with wisdom and strength coexisting, Black Widow is a multi-faceted spy and a warrior. She played an important role in interrogation and battle, etc. Throughout all of the 22 pieces of Marvel movies, they teach their audience about science, military, family, friendship, love, justice, evil, strategy, law, morals and ethics, right and wrong, team spirit, etc. If Marvel movies can not teach the audience about something, then, I can’t stop wondering what kinds of the movie can actually be educational, or does this kind of movie really exist?

More than that, Martin Scorsese argued that Marvel movies can not be considered as cinema, because they were purely made for commercials. As he stated in the article, “They are sequels in name but they are remakes in spirit, and everything in them is officially sanctioned because it can’t really be any other way. That’s the nature of modern film franchises: market-researched, audience-tested, vetted, modified, revetted, and remodified until they’re ready for consumption.” Martin believes that all of the Marvel movies are products of Mcdonaldlization, which were made in the exact same process and standard. He is not wrong about this that Marvel movies are made for commercial, and made to fit most people’s taste. However, it is not relevant to whether Marvel movies are cinema or not. The only thing to determine if Marvel movies are cinema is their quality.  From a purely technological perspective, Marvel movies are cinema: They’re feature-length, narrative-based blockbuster experiences, with precise characters and long-standing pop-culture currency. At the same time, they clearly exist within a different category of cinematic expression, one mandated by capitalist pressures above all else. Therefore, Marvel movies should be considered as cinema, even though they’re made for commercials.

Reference

Eric Kohn, Marvel Movies Vs. Cinema: Why Martin Scorsese and Others Should Sit Out This Debate. Retrieve April 09, 2021, from https://www.indiewire.com/2019/10/scorsese-marvel-movies-vs-cinema-debate-1202183984/

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Scorsese Isn’t Wrong About Marvel (He Isn’t Right, Either) Retrieve April 09, 2021, from https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/kareem-abdul-jabbar-scorsese-wasn-t-wrong-marvel-he-wasn-t-right-1247063

Martin Scorsese goes about to say how he does not think Marvel movies are not considered cinema and he is using this article as a way to explain what he meant by that statement he made during the Empire magazine interview. He defines what cinema is and he defines it as “ about revelation… the complexity of people… the way they can hurt one another and love one another and suddenly come face to face with themselves.” He then says Marvel does not have “ revelation, mystery or genuine emotional danger. Nothing is at risk.” and that is what he means when he does not consider it cinema. He then names Marvel “ worldwide audiovisual entertainment” as he describes Marvel as a series that panders to what the people want which is franchises and being seen on Netflix over the big screen in movie theaters.

The problems with some of his claims is that Marvel in fact does have what it takes to be cinema. He says Marvel does not have “revelation, mystery or genuine emotional danger. Nothing is at risk.”, while in fact it does. There were so many scenes that represent cinema during Infinity War and Endgame, and I will be using those 2 as examples because those are the most popular ones. During Infinity War, there was mystery as during the end of it you would not know what was going to happen next. You were left on a cliff hanger once Thanos got half of the population wiped and during some of those scenes, there was also genuine emotional danger. I am talking about the scene where Spiderman gets deleted right in front Iron Man, and you can really feel for Iron Man because he was treating Spiderman like his own son during the entire movie. During Endgame, there was the moment at the end where Iron Man sacrifices his own life to bring back everyone back from the quantum realm and after that the burial scene play and there was emotional connections between all the characters who went to his burial and even his daughter was there, the main reason he did not want to go to the war at the first place to take care of her. Marvel also shows the complexity of people and how “they can hurt one another and suddenly come face to face with themselves” during Endgame. When Black Widow and Hawkeye went to go for the soul stones they had a difficult time deciding who to sacrifice to get the stone, they were fighting each other wanting each other to live as whoever sacrifices themselves for the soul stone would be gone forever. Another way Marvel showed the complexity between people is how some of the super heroes act in the first scene of Endgame, no heroes wanted to join the fight because they all have families to care for. They can’t just run out there in the battlefield and just blow up Thanos, which they later just did but it took them a while which was 5 years and then wanted to take action again. How Martin Scorsese describes cinema, Marvel has all of those features so Martin’s points are somewhat contradictory.

According to Scorsese, he claims that marvel movies are not cinema (Scorsese, 2019). Scorsese describes cinema as having “aesthetic, emotional and spiritual revelation” (Scorsese, 2019). Well, what is cinema then? Since the word cinema can be so broad in definitions, everyone has their own understanding of this word. There is no right way in what cinema should be like. Cinema is art, even Scorsese himself agrees with this (Scorsese, 2019).  In art, what is most important is the ability to be creative and be able to expressive themselves. Marvel movies are still made with creativity, so why should it not be considered cinema. Marvel movies are based on comic books, today they are considered comic book classics. The marvel comic movies like the original comic books represent an art form that has influenced many adults and children. When people watch marvel movies, they still experience aesthetics, emotions, and spiritual revelation. The marvel movies have many different characters range in different super abilities to gender (Larman et al, 2021). When there are a variety of characters people will develop some type of connection to something. For example, when you watch a Marvel movie all the special abilities the character has really made kids want to be like them and be able to make a difference in the world. This is an aesthetic, emotional, and spiritual connection to the Marvel movies. If the Marvel movies did not have aesthetic appeal why would anyone watch the movies, and why would it make a child want to make a difference in the world. The explanation for this is they have an emotional and spiritual connection to the movie or there will not be this reaction. Marvel made $2.8 billion from just Avenger: Endgame (Larman et al, 2021). If Marvel did not appeal to people’s aesthetic, emotions, and spiritual needs, it can’t explain why the movies are making so much money. 

Scorsese also expresses the threat of following trends society creates for the film industry (Scorsese, 2019).  Scorsese describes how in today’s film industry everything is based on “market-researched, audience-tested, vetted, modified, revetted and remodified” (Scorsese, 2019). These changes are made because of the changing of society and the technology around us. In marvel films today, we use many different high-tech techniques that have allowed for better representation of characters in marvel movies (Child, 2019). Society has changed to a society that relies heavily on technology. Scorsese needs to understand that even with all the market research and the other adjustments made to the film, is not just based on money, but also on other considerations like the creativity of the creators of the film. Scorsese himself even accepted to complete a film with Netflix (Scorsese, 2019). Scorsese followed the trend of using big online movie platforms to help him with his film, so has does not really have a strong argument about other films being made and heavily influenced by social trends created by society. Also, technology will only become more involved in the entertainment industry and things will continue to change, and move more further away from what the entertainment industry use to be.  

Child, B. (2019, October 17). ‘Of course Marvel is CINEMA!’ why THE Scorsese backlash is justified. https://www.theguardian.com/film/2019/oct/17/of-course-marvel-is-cinema-why-the-scorsese-backlash-is-justified-kevin-smith-taika-waititi. 

Larman, A., Larman, A., Duggan, M., Armstrong, M., Jeffrey, J., Stewart, G., … Podcast. (2021, February 19). Martin Scorsese vs Marvel: a tale of two different cinematic perspectives: Alexander Larman. The Critic Magazine. https://thecritic.co.uk/martin-scorsese-vs-marvel-a-tale-of-two-different-cinematic-perspectives/. 

The author Martin Scorsese pointed out in his argument why Marvel is not regarded as a movie theater or in a sense not worthy of its fame. One of the author’s points is that Marvel is a commercial product and does not have the enlightenment required by movies. He pointed out in the article: “They are sequels in name but they are remakes in spirit, and everything in them is officially sanctioned because it can’t really be any other way. That’s the nature of modern film franchises: market-researched, audience-tested, vetted, modified, revetted, and remodified until they’re ready for consumption.” This sentence makes me wonder because is the movie he made purely for charity? I believe that there is no movie that does not want to get a good box office after it is released. Every movie has invested a huge amount of money in the early stage, so the income after the movie is released is reasonable. Marvel movies should not be criticized for this. In addition, he also mentioned that the series of blockbusters are now the first choice in many places. Some of the points he pointed out were jealous, such as: “It’s a perilous time in film exhibition, and there are fewer independent theaters than ever. The equation has flipped and streaming has become the primary delivery system.” “Except for franchising Apart from movies, there is no other opportunity to show other movies on the big screen.” Wait. In this era of the prevalence of technological networks, it is a very common phenomenon that some viewers are accustomed to watching movies on media platforms. It is also understandable that theaters screen movies to cater to market conditions.

Second, Martin Scorsese proposed that Marvel movies do not meet the definition of traditional movies. He pointed out: “What’s not there is a revelation, mystery or emotional danger. Nothing is at risk. The pictures are made to satisfy a specific set of demands, and they are designed as variations on a finite number of themes.” But the facts are not In this way, Marvel movies contain a lot of spiritual lessons. For example, the article Spiritual Lessons From the Marvel Cinematic Universe stated: “In the newest MCU feature film, Captain Marvel comes to realize that what’s she been told about her enemy isn’t true. Don’t judge a person by his or her appearance. Don’t listen to gossip about others. Sometimes, it’s hard to know the enemy. Pay attention to their actions, not just their words.” These contents are all spiritual education to the audience. Therefore, it is not so subjective to think that Marvel movies are not movies. Martin Scorsese’s point of view is obviously biased against Marvel movies. Even if he does not approve of Marvel movies from the perspective of a director, you cannot deny that it is a success. You can dislike it, but you can’t be prejudiced about it. As Eric Kohn quoted in the debate: “It’s like asking Picasso to assess Banksy: One might have an opinion about the other’s work, but it’s hard to imagine why it would matter any more than anyone else weighing in.” Eric Kohn argued in the debate that changing the most obvious definition of film requires revision. Marvel movies belong to a certain type of film. Although it incorporates modern technology, it does not mean that Marvel movies are meaningless.

“Spiritual Lessons From the Marvel Cinematic Universe” 24, April 2019 https://www.ulc.org/ulc-blog/spiritual-lessons-from-the-marvel-cinematic-universe

Eric Khon, 23, October 2019 “Marvel Movies Vs. Cinema: Why Martin Scorsese and Others Should Sit Out This Debate”, IndieWire https://www.indiewire.com/2019/10/scorsese-marvel-movies-vs-cinema-debate-1202183984/

Filmmaker Martin Scorsese wrote an article to account for his claim about how Marvel movies in Cinema in an interview with Empire magazine. At the beginning of the article, Martin explained how him not considering marvel movies as cinemas is just a matter of “personal taste” and went further on to explain why certain films are films whereas marvel movies are not. In the claim above, we can see Martin claiming that him not considering marvel movies as not cinema is a “matter of personal taste.” The standard definition of cinema is the production of movies as an art or industry. Art cannot be tied down to a person’s “personal taste.” Art itself is a broad term. Different people consider different things art. Moreover, Martin out of all people as a filmmaker should know that. His claim of Marvel movies not being art just because it does not suit his personal taste is controversial because the movie industry produces a wide genre of movies; targeting different audiences for each genre based on their personal taste.

Moreover, Martin stated that Marvel films are not just a matter of supply and demand because “it’s a chicken-and-egg issue” where a person wants one specific thing due to being used to getting that thing over and over again. However, this claim can be considered a bit controversial because Marvel producers have the option of adding and subtracting details every time, changing up the storyline, even changing up the character lineup and much more every time they are producing a Marvel movie. 

Furthermore, Martin claims there are pictures that deserve to be on screen arguably more than Marvel movies since they deliver a wide genre of emotions and genres. While, Marvel movies are not cinemas to Marvin because at the end of the day every single one of them are superhero movies. However, just because Marvel movies are superhero movies does not mean they are not cinema because However, Marvel movies do the same. As a personal viewer of Marvel movies, I would like to state that I look forward to every new movie to see what would happen next and I am sure I would not be looking forward to Marvel movies if I already knew what would be happening in the next movie. And, I can assure you that 54% of US adults aged from 18 to 34 would not be doing the same if all Marvel movies delivered the same emotions and storyline every time. Besides, Americans get their daily dose of the “chicken-and-egg” issue by going to their 9:00am to 5:00pm job every day.

To tie it all together, Marvel movies are cinemas because they deliver a wide genre of emotions with various characters and storylines in each and every one. And, Filmmaker Martin himself explained that him not considering Marvel movies as cinemas is a matter of “personal taste”  inthe article. Moreover, more than half the population of US adults including me seem to watch Marvel movies and look forward to every upcoming one. Therefore, it would be safe to say that the popular opinion about Marvel movies would be that they ARE indeed cinemas.

The author Martin Scorsese in his argument points out many points on how Marvel is not considered a cinema or is not worth its fame in a sense. One of the author’s points is that there is just no opportunity given to other movies on the big screen other than franchise movies. It was stated in his article that “you might argue, can’t they just go home and watch anything else they want on Netflix or iTunes or Hulu? Sure — anywhere but on the big screen, where the filmmaker intended her or his picture to be seen.” This quote gives off a sense of broken pride and jealousy because he also made a movie called “ The Irishman” as stated in the text and wanted to be in the theater longer since it sorta a symbol of acceptance and accomplishment as a producer. His argument is just not valid with that mindset, marvel does not produce low quality movies, it is a series of movies that build off with approval. Marvel did not become what it is today without hardship and not all movies were all successful at first, but over time it got better and became what it is today. His point is just too biased based, his movie “The Irishman” was a huge hit as well rating really high in rotten tomato beating avenger endgame. It’s not like his movies were bad, it ‘s just that his pride as a director seems to have made him think that Marvel series is not considered cinema. Franchises can die anytime if it weren’t good, which means marvel does produce movies that worth its name.

Another point that the author made is that he thinks of marvel movies as just movies with spectacular effects and predictable story-line. I myself like special effects. This is not biased, we just generally like these effects like fireworks. It just attracts us, supernatural being included in this element makes things more attractive since it is something we don’t have but wish to have, it just makes a movie attractive in its own way. The second part of his point on how the marvel story-line is generic and does not see any development on an emotional level with the character. According to Aubreyonna Van Hoose a reporter that responded to Martin Scorsese’s post stated that “the Marvel movies follow a solid story-line that provides a clear indication of emotional experiences. For example, the underlying theme in “Infinity War” into “Endgame” is man versus self. As each hero addresses their lack in ability to cope with loss, much as any human does, they also struggle with inner obstacles.” Marvel is a connected story-line through a series of movies, it’s characters have been developed for a long time, it is true that a single movie there might be a lack of character development but that cause many of them have been already developed just that it is not in a single movie. Being a franchise many of its viewers have seen many of marvel individual movies of character, we got an understanding already and that many are connected to each individual character. Cinema means something that brings entertainment to the audience and marvel does that part well. The author stated that Marvel is a theme park, that not bad if it brings joy to people, it is not something bad. Overall Martin Scoresse point of view is based on his own ideal as a director and creator, which is a biased view. If Martin Scoresse had watched all of the marvel movies up until now he might get a better understanding of each movie.

Reference:

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2019/oct/17/of-course-marvel-is-cinema-why-the-scorsese-backlash-is-justified-kevin-smith-taika-waititi

https://www.bgfalconmedia.com/entertainment/are-marvel-movies-real-cinema/article_7b45b71c-f0f8-11e9-af58-dbb5430acccb.html

In one of his interviews, filmmaker Martin Scorsese states that Marvel movies are not cinema. He goes on to provide a few arguments why he thinks this way. Here is one of his claims: “Many franchise films are made by people of considerable talent and artistry. You can see it on the screen. The fact that the films themselves don’t interest me is a matter of personal taste and temperament. I know that if I were younger, if I’d come of age at a later time, I might have been excited by these pictures and maybe even wanted to make one myself. But I grew up when I did and I developed a sense of movies — of what they were and what they could be — that was as far from the Marvel universe as we on Earth are from Alpha Centauri.” In other words, Martin Scorsese is trying to convey that movies nowadays are different from the concept he has developed about them, and these differences may have come due to time. Movies of 2010’s are not produced with the same perspectives that movies of the 1980’s were. He admits that if he was younger, he would have a better opinion about Marvel productions, but he comes from a different era of movies and this plays a huge role on his points of view. However, even though they are different from former film forms, Marvel movies have a great significance in the American cinema. They generate about $4 billion and attract over 100 million viewers. Marvel Studios have settled new styles of films, which include sci-fi, action, and superhero genres. (Dewan, 2020) 

Another argument of Martin Scorsese is: “For me, for the filmmakers I came to love and respect, for my friends who started making movies around the same time that I did, cinema was about revelation — aesthetic, emotional and spiritual revelation. It was about characters — the complexity of people and their contradictory and sometimes paradoxical natures, the way they can hurt one another and love one another and suddenly come face to face with themselves.” Here, Martin Scorses is trying to point out an element that he thinks is absent in Marvel movies: the paradoxical nature of characters. He sees many elements of cinema in Marvel movies, but what’s missing is spiritual revelation, mystery or genuine emotional danger. Nevertheless, this can be seen in Marvel pictures. Marvel has given a type of humanity and sensitivity to their characters who seem to be exceptional to possess such feelings. This feature can be noticed in the heroes and villains as well. “We see the fury and the betrayal behind Killmonger in Black Panther, a longing for acceptance and control in Loki, and the distorted perceptions of saving the universe in Thanos, and for a moment we sympathize with them. We understand them, albeit in disagreement, but their motives are clear and for some, it is not pure evil.” (Kaity, 2019) 

Dewan, Rohan. “Sorry Scorsese, Marvel Movies Are Cinema.” The Tide, thermtide.com/9777/popular/sorry-scorsese-marvel-movies-are-cinema/. 

/* inline tdc_css att */.tdi_107{padding-right:10px !important;}/* custom css */.tdb-post-meta{ margin-bottom: 16px; color: #444; font-family: ‘Open Sans’, et al. “Why Marvel Superhero Movies Are Important.” Nerds and Beyond, 28 Jan. 2021, www.nerdsandbeyond.com/2019/10/28/why-marvel-superhero-movies-are-important/.